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I Made Mike Mentzer’s Ideal Routine… Ideal.

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44 comments

@DennisMenjivar-ym8bl December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
Your physique is lacking everywhere. This style of training is not benefiting you
@ardeleanuradu December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
Not bad, but you dance a lot. Keep your feet grounded. Also, you developed quite a belly. GH or insulin?
@rayderlord4633 December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
Man I fkn love this new format you're doing, with the revamped old/ famous legends live training , with your expert modern science applied to it, fine tuning/ updating it, it's so fluid and comprehensive at same time, and we get so much from this type of content .. more of it ! 🔥🦾🙏🏽
@TheOverman2006 December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
I think there's still no proper scientific framework for effective excercise. If we want to come up with a proper theory of efficient excercise we must first answer these questions:

1. How much does it take for a muscle to recover from 1 set to failure?
2. How much does it take for a muscle to recover from 1 set to 1-2RIR?
3. If a set to failure generates 100 units of stimulus, how much does a set to 1-2 RIR generate?
4. If a set to failure generates 100 units of fatigue, how much does a set to 1-2 RIR generate?
5. How long do joints, ligaments, tendons take to recover after failure versus 1-2 RIR?

Once we have answers to these questions, we can adjust each variable—stimulus, fatigue, and recovery—to create an optimal exercise framework that maximizes results while minimizing unnecessary stress and risk of injury.
@RorschachNL December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
Make one for the other workouts jay
@AlexLekas_TakeOne December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
This has nothing to do with Mentzer. It's just a different routine. Nothing wrong with that, but that's what it is
@Spirit-FilledMindset December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
First off, that was just one day out of 4 of Mike's routine. That wasn't even the latest version of his routine. Second, there's a reason Mike put the flys before the incline press. Listen to Mike on why. Third, Mike includes pull over in his latest version and supersets into palm up close grip pulldown. Again, good reasoning on this, listen to Mike as to why. Mike also gives alternatives, so you aren't stuck to doing one specific exercise all the time, every time. So you can still do a row instead of the close grip pull down, but its not optimal for building pure muscle overall. Four, your supersets have way too much time in between. There is a reason they are called supersets. You want as little time as possible in between them. Five, it doesn't necessarily matter which day you do the deadlift. Mike does it on that day because of the structure of the other days he has you doing work. Also, it works the whole backside of the body, and I would say the lower back a LOT. So its actually good to put on the back day. Six, Mike has reverse flys on shoulder and arm day, so that's already covered.

After all this, I believe Mike's routine is still WAY better.
@IvanHristow-ti9tf December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
Thanks, great video. You should mate more videos like this one, but to show different splits for the rest muscles of the body.
@inkwell101 December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
Mentzer suggested flyes first because then on the press, the triceps are fresh and can push the chest even further.

Also, go all the way down on the press, you're like 6 inches too high at the bottom of your rep. The stretch under load is where muscle is built
@smartstrength4414 December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
So is this worth 3 or 4 more pounds of muscle? 😉
@Eliska216 December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
No you didnt. Study Mentzer more influencer
@NebulaElite December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
Dont see a good stretch on the incline chest press. Looks more like half reps. Bad machine.
@tedwhite9359 December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
The first time doing a new exercise, I would not go to failure. Supersetting a new exercise with another - the first time will take longer than expected to recover if not conditioned to it unless using HRT. If natural, use the first workout or two with new exercises to acclimate without supersetting. Pair up the 2 in a superset 3rd time around with a short rest period and go to failure.
@JD_82 December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
@jay are you gonna do the other workout days of this program? Arm, legs etc
@DrOrr December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
Man I got sick for a whole week had to take over 7 days off and came back and was noticeably stronger using the GES, I’m genuinely surprised, and this was with a hangover too.
@thijsswinkels8230 December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
Can someone tell me if its okey to do two exercises for one bodypart? Isn't that to much overlap? My basic routine is one exercise for chest back and legs
@nealeade5783 December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
Thanks for your take on this, I did the ideal routine for about 6 months but ended up going back to your golden era system as I could tolerate a bit more volume. Merry Christmas, hope you have a good one 🎉
@trentonbrooks9121 December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
This reminds me of that one kid with the small arms telling Lee priest how to work out his arms like bro I don’t think he needs your help Mike Mentzer got a lot right and wrong but even modern day science goes against the “mods” you’re making I’ll go with Mentzer still 😂 try putting “ideal for me” that would be better and emphasis the stretch never the contraction and don’t overlook the eccentric and time under tension generally good for everyone but still different for EVERY INDIVIDUAL!
@callmedave8802 December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
Love it, hopefully you'll be making more ideal ideal routines for the other days (shoulders+arm and Legs)
@vancemcnulty8242 December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
Jay would you say that plate loaded machines such as hammerstrength are more ideal for a public/home gym and less for a client centered personal training studio where pin loaded may be more ideal? Very good exercise demos.
@mbrat357 December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
At the time Mentzer prescribed the ideal routine, he did not recommend a rep speed of 2/4 but 4/4.
@luesternerlustmolch December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
Isn't the rear delt fly a bit redundant?
@sokaiya1 December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
awesome Jay! Annoying monkey rap in the background shieeet
@arielH8610 December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
In his Heavy Duty 2 routines Menzter never recommended the 2 -1- 4 cadence. The Heavy Duty 2 cadence is 4 -1 -4.''Muscles in Minutes ''is not a book by Mike,.It is a book after his death.
@tillvalhalla2271 December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
I did the Ideal Routine for over a year and steadily made progress on the program. Due to boredom and burnout, I made slight adjustments like Jay recently in reversing the order in some of the exercises, changing some, and dropping the supersets. I'll see how it goes soon.
@thecrow4597 December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
I have a sensitive nervous system and low exercise tolerance. I’ve found that the HIT exercise selection, the machines used, and style of reps is absolutely the best but I do 2-3 non failure sets instead. I feel great and always have a healthy amount of muscle. One set to failure absolutely destroys me and leaves my nervous system wrecked for too long. For some it’s probably great!
@1seanv December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
My variation of the Ideal Routine:

A.
Gironda Dip
Closegrip Palms Up Pulldown
Stifflegged Deadlift
Leg Extension
Calf Raise
B.
Seated Dumbell Press
Barbell Curl
Barbell Rollover and Press
Barbell Power Shrug (they work, sue me)
Bent Laterals
Barbell Wrist Curl
C.
Barbell Neck Press (modified bench press)
One Arm Dumbell Row
Barbell Full Squat
Seated Leg Curl
Calf Raise
D.
Barbell Curl
JM Press
Seated Laterals
Barbell Power Shrug
Bent Laterals
Barbell Wrist Curl

Definitely extra focus placed on the traps and forearms, but the goal with this was to get the major muscle groups directly stimulated once every 8-10 days, and the smaller muscles getting stimulated directly every 8-10 days, with both smaller and larger muscle groups getting some level of stimulation every 4th or 5th day for hypertrophy purposes.

Workouts A and C are the most taxing so I limit it to 5 exercises - 1 set each. B and D get 6 but 7 works too if it's a smaller isolation exercise.

Every single muscle gets hit with enough direct and indirect stimulation with this routine that I think it actually could build a competitive physique. Some HIT routines are a little too abbreviated to really build a complete bodybuilding type of physique.

A couple of the exercises come from the iron guru Vince Gironda (RIP) - specifically the Barbell Neck Press, Gironda Dip, and Barbell Rollover and Press. The first two are the best chest exercises I have ever tried when performed "correctly". Some might poo poo the neck press, but at 5'9" and 225lbs, I am currently using 165lbs on it when I could bench press far more in typical fashion. The Barbell Rollover and Press acts as both a serious tricep exercise - hitting all three heads of the tricep, but also as a pullover for the lats as well. Flyes are completely unnecessary as the Gironda Dips and Barbell Neck Press offer more than enough pec stimulation when performed correctly.

I've tried to come up with a better, more complete yet basic routine than this, but haven't succeeded. Imo it doesn't get much better than this for this type of routine.
@nbarealtalker December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
I find one of my biggest hang ups with HIT is that as my clients have gotten stronger, I may have fussed too hard about keeping the reps “pure” and slow. When it’s really about the change of direction. I’d back down every once in a while to try and robotically replicate the reps from previous weights but like you said, as long as you push it to failure, the speed within the rep isn’t that much of a difference maker as long as you’re not bouncing it out of the hole.
@goodman_1955 December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
Isn't that the other way around, stronger at the bottom, weaker at the top.
@michaeldean1163 December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
Jay, I like that you said the goal is 1 set, but it's not universal law. Most people don't know how to push to true failure but honesty the research shows lifting haeavy enough you don't need total failure you can get away with 2 RIR and studies show that 5 sets can get the job done for Hypertrophy even as low as 3 sets as well. Great video, I always learn something new. Keep up the excellent work.
@theChadRamroq December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
What about Snatch Grip Rack pulls from the knee instead of Deadlifts, since it does stress the upper back to an extent?
@ArturoGarciaAlmaraz December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
Doing only a row can work good the rear delts?
@kurtkelley2955 December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
Jay, Mike liked to pre exhaust the chest without fatiguing the triceps. That is why he started with the fly to preserve the triceps from the pushing exercise. I tried it on a client this morning, I was probably putting words in his mouth, but he said he felt his chest more when we got to the chest press. Love your stuff and can't wait for your invention.
@Bl4zik3n December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
disappointed in you here
@joerockhead7246 December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
those are some nice machines
@miamidolphinsfan December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
Jay, could you do a series on mobility & getting older, and the best exercises that will help folks that are in mobility decline due to edging. Thanks & Merry Christmas to you & your family bye y'all 🎅
@jellewierda3828 December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
Could you make a bodyweight version of this? I train with gymnastic rings. So ring dips followed by ring flys or pushups. Chinups followed bij ring rows... legs i do weights. Deadlift and splitsquats. And handstand pushups or pike pushups for shoulder's
@kia-soul9191 December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
Jay Vincent's modified routine:

Chest:
1. Chest Press (4:05)
superset with...
2. Chest Fly (5:31)

Back:
1. Pull Over (or Pull Down) (8:52)
2. Rows (Preferable on a machine) (10:04)

Mike Mentzer's ideal routine:

Chest:
1. Pec Deck (or dumbbell flies)
superset with...
2. Incline Press

Back:
1. Close Grip Underhand Pull Downs
2. Deadlifts (or substitute for shrugs in case of lower back pain)
@buffysummers6902 December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
hello.thanks for all.how many rest day after that?
@JesusGarcia-Digem December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
Chest and back combined on the same day?
@AndreLeitedaSilvaGaldino December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
Damn, i need to try this one. The chenges made sense to me. It always made me wonder why not do the compound exercises first and than finish with the isolation to "kill " the target muscle
@davidmccright3764 December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
I actually really like these modifications. I enjoyed the Heavy Duty II routine, but I definitely like this version. I think doing antagonistic supersets where you’d alternate chest and back would be fantastic here as well.
@SoChilledOutGuy December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
gotta turn up your mic gain or raise the volume in your editing software
@thomashilmersen711 December 26, 2024 - 5:28 am
I just do not see how a PT could make me train more intensely. I push until I can no longer move the bar, no matter how hard I try. It is 100%. It can't be more. And look at the vids of Arthur Jones training Boyer Coe, for example. When he tries to push Coe to get another rep, Coe simply starts cheating in order to make the extra reps. He could probably train just as intensely, with perfect form, on his own.

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